August 2006 - sg16-avd - lists.packetizer.com

Q1/16 meeting has concluded: report and documents
by Patrick Luthi 31 Aug '06

31 Aug '06

Dear experts, The Rapporteur meeting of Q.1/16 has concluded. The meeting report can be found here: http://ftp3.itu.int/av-arch/lbc-site/0608_Ottawa/q1f13r1.doc The final list of documents is available here: http://ftp3.itu.ch/av-arch/lbc-site/0608_Ottawa/q1f00r1.doc Best regards, Patrick Luthi Rapporteur for Q.1/16

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RE: Document number allocation request
by Paul E. Jones 26 Aug '06

26 Aug '06

Ishikawa-san, I have not experienced any problems accessing the server: the performance has been good. So, it must be a problem with the connection from Japan to Geneva. (This server is owned and operated by the ITU in Geneva, Switzerland.) I tested the server just now and downloaded a file at 1.6Mbps. Unfortunately, I'm not sure what to suggest to you. Paul > -----Original Message----- > From: ishikawa [mailto:chiaki.ishikawa@ubin.jp] > Sent: Friday, August 25, 2006 6:48 AM > To: Paul E. Jones > Cc: youichi.takashima(a)ubin.jp; 'Noboru Koshizuka'; itu- > sg16(a)external.cisco.com; ishikawa > Subject: Re: Document number allocation request > > Dear Paul E. Jones, > > I am not sure to whom I should report this network problem, but > thought you might be the first choice for me. > > The ftp site which we are using, ftp3.itu.int > seems to have a very narrow bandwidth to the outside, for example, Japan. > > I have no idea why it is so slow, but I monitor the transfer rate > dropping down from 1.5 Kb/sec to almost nil when I tried to > download the mentioned file today at aroun 19:45 JST (9 hours ahead of > UTC). > > This may be a temporary anomaly, but given the slowness I observed the > other > day, this may be a symptom from long-lingerling underlying problem. > > Or it may be that the bandwidth is shared by MANY connections. I have no > idea. > > But given this transfer rate, I feel that some participants who try to > download the presentation files in the one week window immediately prior > to > the meetings may get frustrated. > > Just wanted to share my finding of this narrow bandwidth problem. > > Looking forward to seeing you in Ottawa. > (My colleagues and I leave for Canada this coming Sunday [Japan Standard > Time].) > > Sincerely > Chiaki Ishikawa > > Paul E. Jones wrote: > > Ishikawa-san, > > > > I have uploaded the document as AVD-2935a.zip. > > > > I accepted all of the changes appearing in revision marks. I edited the > > contact footer so that it only appears on the first page. I also edited > the > > contact lines so that the word "Contact" does not appear on each line. > > > > Paul > > > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: Ishikawa, Chiaki [mailto:chiaki.ishikawa@ubin.jp] > >> Sent: Monday, August 21, 2006 5:49 PM > >> To: Paul E. Jones > >> Cc: youichi.takashima(a)ubin.jp; 'Noboru Koshizuka'; 'Ishikawa, Chiaki'; > >> itu-sg16(a)external.cisco.com > >> Subject: Re: Document number allocation request > >> > >> > >> Dear Paul E. Jones, > >> > >> We have made a few last minute changes (fixing typos, misspells, etc.) > >> to the document which was submitted a few hours ago. > >> I uploaded a file to the ftp site. > >> So please use the latest file uploaded to the ftp site. > >> (We may still make another change or two. Catching English mistakes > >> is difficult for non-native English speakers.) > >> > >> Thank you in advance for your attention. > >> > >> Sincerely, > >> Chiaki Ishikawa > >> > >> Paul E. Jones wrote: > >>> Takashima-san, > >>> > >>> Please use AVD-2935. > >>> > >>> Thanks! > >>> Paul > >>> > >>> > >>>> -----Original Message----- > >>>> From: youichi.takashima(a)ubin.jp [mailto:youichi.takashima@ubin.jp] > >>>> Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 4:33 AM > >>>> To: Paul Jones > >>>> Cc: Noboru Koshizuka; Ishikawa, Chiaki > >>>> Subject: Document number allocation request > >>>> > >>>> Dear Paul, > >>>> > >>>> Could you allocate a document number to the following contribution? > >>>> > >>>> Source: YRP Ubiquitous Networking Laboratory > >>>> Title: Analysis of Information Delivery Applications using Networked > ID > >>>> Question: 22 > >>>> > >>>> This is a "proposal" document. > >>>> > >>>> Best regards, > >>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- > - > >>>> Youichi TAKASHIMA > >>>> YRP Ubiquitous Networking Laboratory > >>>> Phone +81 3 5437 2270 > >>>> Facsimile +81 3 5437 2329 > >>>> 2-20-1 Nishi-Gotanda, Shinagawa-ku, Tokyo 141-0031 JAPAN > >>>> > >>>> > > > > > > > > > >

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Re: Document number allocation request
by ishikawa 25 Aug '06

25 Aug '06

Dear Paul E. Jones, I am not sure to whom I should report this network problem, but thought you might be the first choice for me. The ftp site which we are using, ftp3.itu.int seems to have a very narrow bandwidth to the outside, for example, Japan. I have no idea why it is so slow, but I monitor the transfer rate dropping down from 1.5 Kb/sec to almost nil when I tried to download the mentioned file today at aroun 19:45 JST (9 hours ahead of UTC). This may be a temporary anomaly, but given the slowness I observed the other day, this may be a symptom from long-lingerling underlying problem. Or it may be that the bandwidth is shared by MANY connections. I have no idea. But given this transfer rate, I feel that some participants who try to download the presentation files in the one week window immediately prior to the meetings may get frustrated. Just wanted to share my finding of this narrow bandwidth problem. Looking forward to seeing you in Ottawa. (My colleagues and I leave for Canada this coming Sunday [Japan Standard Time].) Sincerely Chiaki Ishikawa Paul E. Jones wrote: > Ishikawa-san, > > I have uploaded the document as AVD-2935a.zip. > > I accepted all of the changes appearing in revision marks. I edited the > contact footer so that it only appears on the first page. I also edited the > contact lines so that the word "Contact" does not appear on each line. > > Paul > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Ishikawa, Chiaki [mailto:chiaki.ishikawa@ubin.jp] >> Sent: Monday, August 21, 2006 5:49 PM >> To: Paul E. Jones >> Cc: youichi.takashima(a)ubin.jp; 'Noboru Koshizuka'; 'Ishikawa, Chiaki'; >> itu-sg16(a)external.cisco.com >> Subject: Re: Document number allocation request >> >> >> Dear Paul E. Jones, >> >> We have made a few last minute changes (fixing typos, misspells, etc.) >> to the document which was submitted a few hours ago. >> I uploaded a file to the ftp site. >> So please use the latest file uploaded to the ftp site. >> (We may still make another change or two. Catching English mistakes >> is difficult for non-native English speakers.) >> >> Thank you in advance for your attention. >> >> Sincerely, >> Chiaki Ishikawa >> >> Paul E. Jones wrote: >>> Takashima-san, >>> >>> Please use AVD-2935. >>> >>> Thanks! >>> Paul >>> >>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: youichi.takashima(a)ubin.jp [mailto:youichi.takashima@ubin.jp] >>>> Sent: Friday, August 18, 2006 4:33 AM >>>> To: Paul Jones >>>> Cc: Noboru Koshizuka; Ishikawa, Chiaki >>>> Subject: Document number allocation request >>>> >>>> Dear Paul, >>>> >>>> Could you allocate a document number to the following contribution? >>>> >>>> Source: YRP Ubiquitous Networking Laboratory >>>> Title: Analysis of Information Delivery Applications using Networked ID >>>> Question: 22 >>>> >>>> This is a "proposal" document. >>>> >>>> Best regards, >>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> Youichi TAKASHIMA >>>> YRP Ubiquitous Networking Laboratory >>>> Phone +81 3 5437 2270 >>>> Facsimile +81 3 5437 2329 >>>> 2-20-1 Nishi-Gotanda, Shinagawa-ku, Tokyo 141-0031 JAPAN >>>> >>>> > > > >

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RE: AVD-2911a and AVD-2913a
by Paul E. Jones 24 Aug '06

24 Aug '06

Thanks! The revised documents will be posted shortly. Paul > -----Original Message----- > From: OKUBO Sakae [mailto:okubo@mxz.mesh.ne.jp] > Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 4:48 AM > To: Paul E. Jones > Cc: itu-sg16(a)external.cisco.com > Subject: AVD-2911a and AVD-2913a > > Dear Paul, > > I have modified AVD-2911 and AVD-2913 as uploaded to the /Incoming > directory. These are referring to the liaison statements that TSB has > recently made available and you have registered as AVD-documents. The > substance is not changed. > > -- > Best regards, > > OKUBO Sakae > e-mail: okubo(a)aoni.waseda.jp > (<== sokubo(a)waseda.jp, valid until 31 March 2007) > Visiting Professor > Global Information and Telecommunication Institute (GITI) > Waseda University > ****************************************************************** > Waseda University, YRP Ichibankan 312 Tel: +81 46 847 5406 > 3-4 Hikarinooka, Yokosuka-shi, Kanagawa-ken Fax: +81 46 847 5413 > 239-0847 Japan > H.323 videoconferencing: arranged by advice > ****************************************************************** >

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AVD-2911a and AVD-2913a
by OKUBO Sakae 24 Aug '06

24 Aug '06

Dear Paul, I have modified AVD-2911 and AVD-2913 as uploaded to the /Incoming directory. These are referring to the liaison statements that TSB has recently made available and you have registered as AVD-documents. The substance is not changed. -- Best regards, OKUBO Sakae e-mail: okubo(a)aoni.waseda.jp (<== sokubo(a)waseda.jp, valid until 31 March 2007) Visiting Professor Global Information and Telecommunication Institute (GITI) Waseda University ****************************************************************** Waseda University, YRP Ichibankan 312 Tel: +81 46 847 5406 3-4 Hikarinooka, Yokosuka-shi, Kanagawa-ken Fax: +81 46 847 5413 239-0847 Japan H.323 videoconferencing: arranged by advice ******************************************************************

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RE: Question on a NAT traversal requirement
by Paul E. Jones 23 Aug '06

23 Aug '06

Roni, This is a requirement statement, not a statement tied to a particular solution. Interpreting the words, I think what I said would be correct irrespective of any particular solution. However, I delved into H.323v1 and H.323v2 discussions, as I think any person's immediate question might be "why not v1 or v2". You said in a separate reply that using an ALG or a proxy solution, even H.323v1 might be supported. That's entirely right, which makes the requirement even more confusing. This requirement just says that, whatever we do to address NAT/FW issues, we need to ensure it works H.323v3 or higher and it's OK if the final solution will not work with H.323v1 or v2. Paul > -----Original Message----- > From: Even, Roni [mailto:roni.even@polycom.co.il] > Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2006 2:45 AM > To: Paul E. Jones; OKUBO Sakae; itu-sg16(a)external.cisco.com > Subject: RE: Question on a NAT traversal requirement > > Paul, > I would like to emphasis that this is true only for Nat traversal based > on H.460 (17, 18, 19) and not to other means of NAT traversal > Roni Even > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Paul E. Jones [mailto:paulej@PACKETIZER.COM] > > Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2006 7:18 AM > > To: 'OKUBO Sakae'; itu-sg16(a)external.cisco.com > > Subject: RE: Question on a NAT traversal requirement > > > > Mr. Okubo, > > > > Given this wording, I would say the answer to your question is "it MAY > > work > > with H.323v1 or H.323v2, but SHALL work with H.323v3, v4, v5, v6, ..." > > > > In reality, I don't believe v1 systems can be supported, since H.323v1 > > systems were required to use H.245v2. H.323v2 lifted this > restriction, so > > devices could implement later versions of H.245 approved independently > of > > H.323. > > > > Paul > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: OKUBO Sakae [mailto:okubo@MXZ.MESH.NE.JP] > > > Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2006 4:10 AM > > > To: itu-sg16(a)external.cisco.com > > > Subject: Question on a NAT traversal requirement > > > > > > Dear NAT traversal experts, > > > > > > TTC (The Telecommunication Technology Committee) is now working on > > > Technical Paper "Requirements for Network Address Translator and > > > Firewall Traversal of H.323 Multimedia Systems" to convert it to a > > > Technical Report in Japanese language. > > > > > > I have a question on how to interpret the following part: > > > > > > ---------- > > > 9.3 Requirements on Signalling and Media Streams > > > b) NAT traversal mechanisms for H.323 multimedia systems shall > > > support no less than ITU-T H.323v3, H.245v7, H.225.0v4, and H.235v3. > > > All later versions of H.323, H.245, H.225.0 and H.235 may be > > > supported. > > > ---------- > > > > > > Take an example of H.323 that has now v6. Which of the following > > > statements are true? > > > > > > NAT traversal > > > > > > 1/ shall not support v1 or v2. > > > 2/ may support v1 or v2. > > > 3/ shall support v3. > > > 4/ shall support v3 and in addition may support any combinations of > > > v4, v5 and v6. > > > 5/ shall support v3 and may support v4, or (v4 and v5), or (v4, v5 > and > > > v6). > > > > > > In other words, NAT traversal with the following support conforms to > > > this requirement: > > > > > > a/ v3 > > > b/ v4 > > > c/ v5 > > > d/ v6 > > > e/ v3, v4 > > > f/ v3, v5 > > > g/ v3, v6 > > > h/ v3, v4, v5 > > > i/ v3, v4, v5, v6 > > > j/ v4, v5 > > > k/ v4, v6 > > > l/ v4, v5, v6 > > > m/ v5, v6 > > > > > > -- > > > Best regards, > > > > > > OKUBO Sakae > > > e-mail: okubo(a)aoni.waseda.jp > > > (<== sokubo(a)waseda.jp, valid until 31 March 2007) > > > Visiting Professor > > > Global Information and Telecommunication Institute (GITI) > > > Waseda University > > > ****************************************************************** > > > Waseda University, YRP Ichibankan 312 Tel: +81 46 847 5406 > > > 3-4 Hikarinooka, Yokosuka-shi, Kanagawa-ken Fax: +81 46 847 5413 > > > 239-0847 Japan > > > H.323 videoconferencing: arranged by advice > > > ****************************************************************** > > > >

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Meeting documents posted
by Paul E. Jones 23 Aug '06

23 Aug '06

Dear Experts, The documents for the meeting next week have all been posted. The current list of document is here: http://ftp3.itu.ch/av-arch/avc-site/2005-2008/0608_Ott/0608_Ott.html I will update that as late arriving documents appear and with any additional liaison statements Rapporteur's request that I post. Before the end of the week, I will publish the list of documents as TD-02, but the above HTML file contains the same contents. If you see any errors in titles, references, etc., please let me know and I will make the necessary changes. Thanks! Paul

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RE: Question on a NAT traversal requirement
by OKUBO Sakae 23 Aug '06

23 Aug '06

Dear all who kindly responded to my question, Now I understand the required minimum versions are coming from the expected use of H.225.0 generic extensibility framework and H.245 generic parameter in the NAT traversal mechanism. ---------- 9.3 Requirements on Signalling and Media Streams b) NAT traversal mechanisms for H.323 multimedia systems shall support no less than ITU-T H.323v3, H.245v7, H.225.0v4, and H.235v3. All later versions of H.323, H.245, H.225.0 and H.235 may be supported. ---------- My original difficulty was in the English expression "shall support no less than version n." It is negative to "less than n" hence equivalent to "n or higher." Furthermore, I understand that version n is a super-set of previous version (n-1), at least in principle ..., in our standards, meaning that version n entity can interwork with any lower version entity. Then the second sentence "may support any later version" would be overlapping with the first sentence. In conclusion, a NAT traversal mechanism with the following H.323 support conforms to this requirement (not mentioning H.245, H.225.0. H.235 for simplicity): a/ v3 b/ v4 c/ v5 d/ v6 e/ v3, v4 ==> equivalent to b/ f/ v3, v5 ==> equivalent to c/ g/ v3, v6 ==> equivalent to d/ h/ v3, v4, v5 ==> equivalent to c/ i/ v3, v4, v5, v6 ==> equivalent to d/ j/ v4, v5 ==> equivalent to c/ k/ v4, v6 ==> equivalent to d/ l/ v4, v5, v6 ==> equivalent to d/ m/ v5, v6 ==> equivalent to d/ I hope I am correct. -- Best regards, OKUBO Sakae e-mail: okubo(a)aoni.waseda.jp (<== sokubo(a)waseda.jp, valid until 31 March 2007) Visiting Professor Global Information and Telecommunication Institute (GITI) Waseda University ****************************************************************** Waseda University, YRP Ichibankan 312 Tel: +81 46 847 5406 3-4 Hikarinooka, Yokosuka-shi, Kanagawa-ken Fax: +81 46 847 5413 239-0847 Japan H.323 videoconferencing: arranged by advice ******************************************************************

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Documents for the next week meeting of Q.1
by Patrick Luthi 23 Aug '06

23 Aug '06

Dear experts, Almost all meeting documents have been posted: http://ftp3.itu.int/av-arch/lbc-site/0608_Ottawa ftp://ftp3.itu.int/lbc-site/0608_Ottawa user: avguest, password: Avguest The list of documents is available here: http://ftp3.itu.ch/av-arch/lbc-site/0608_Ottawa/q1f00.doc Best regards, Patrick Luthi Rapporteur for Q.1/16

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RE: Question on a NAT traversal requirement
by Paul E. Jones 23 Aug '06

23 Aug '06

Mr. Okubo, Given this wording, I would say the answer to your question is "it MAY work with H.323v1 or H.323v2, but SHALL work with H.323v3, v4, v5, v6, ..." In reality, I don't believe v1 systems can be supported, since H.323v1 systems were required to use H.245v2. H.323v2 lifted this restriction, so devices could implement later versions of H.245 approved independently of H.323. Paul > -----Original Message----- > From: OKUBO Sakae [mailto:okubo@MXZ.MESH.NE.JP] > Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2006 4:10 AM > To: itu-sg16(a)external.cisco.com > Subject: Question on a NAT traversal requirement > > Dear NAT traversal experts, > > TTC (The Telecommunication Technology Committee) is now working on > Technical Paper "Requirements for Network Address Translator and > Firewall Traversal of H.323 Multimedia Systems" to convert it to a > Technical Report in Japanese language. > > I have a question on how to interpret the following part: > > ---------- > 9.3 Requirements on Signalling and Media Streams > b) NAT traversal mechanisms for H.323 multimedia systems shall > support no less than ITU-T H.323v3, H.245v7, H.225.0v4, and H.235v3. > All later versions of H.323, H.245, H.225.0 and H.235 may be > supported. > ---------- > > Take an example of H.323 that has now v6. Which of the following > statements are true? > > NAT traversal > > 1/ shall not support v1 or v2. > 2/ may support v1 or v2. > 3/ shall support v3. > 4/ shall support v3 and in addition may support any combinations of > v4, v5 and v6. > 5/ shall support v3 and may support v4, or (v4 and v5), or (v4, v5 and > v6). > > In other words, NAT traversal with the following support conforms to > this requirement: > > a/ v3 > b/ v4 > c/ v5 > d/ v6 > e/ v3, v4 > f/ v3, v5 > g/ v3, v6 > h/ v3, v4, v5 > i/ v3, v4, v5, v6 > j/ v4, v5 > k/ v4, v6 > l/ v4, v5, v6 > m/ v5, v6 > > -- > Best regards, > > OKUBO Sakae > e-mail: okubo(a)aoni.waseda.jp > (<== sokubo(a)waseda.jp, valid until 31 March 2007) > Visiting Professor > Global Information and Telecommunication Institute (GITI) > Waseda University > ****************************************************************** > Waseda University, YRP Ichibankan 312 Tel: +81 46 847 5406 > 3-4 Hikarinooka, Yokosuka-shi, Kanagawa-ken Fax: +81 46 847 5413 > 239-0847 Japan > H.323 videoconferencing: arranged by advice > ****************************************************************** >

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