Report of the Raleigh meeting

OKUBO Sakae okubo at MXZ.MESH.NE.JP
Sat Aug 24 11:34:01 EDT 2002


my answers in the usual style included inline below.

With kind regards

Martin Euchner.
| Dipl.-Inf.                     Rapporteur Q.G/SG16
| Martin Euchner                 Phone: +49 89 722 55790
| Siemens AG.....................Fax  : +49 89 722 47713
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 -----Original Message-----
From:   Paul Long [mailto:plong at]
Sent:   Thursday, August 22, 2002 3:58 AM
To:     ITU-SG16 at echo.jf.INTEL.COM
Cc:     Euchner Martin  ICN M SR 3
Subject:        Re: Flaws in H.235 media encryption

comments inline (and boy are they long this time)

> Paul,
> first of all: thanks to the very good and detailed observations
pointing out
> some problematic issues with H.235 key update. As I argue below,
items #2
> and #3 hit a weak point and should be corrected in some fashion and
> documented. I consider item #1 less critical (but let's see).
> Second: sorry for the long delay, but I was quite busy with other
things and
> emails...
> Generally, I would like to point out that using the replacementFor
> should thwart against all three problems; but please my more detailed
> comments and answers below.
> With kind regards
> Martin Euchner.
>  -----Original Message-----
> From:   Paul Long [mailto:plong at]
> Sent:   Monday, August 12, 2002 7:39 PM
> To:     itu-sg16 at
> Cc:     Euchner Martin  ICN M SR 3
> Subject:        Flaws in H.235 media encryption
> 1. After distributing a new key via an encryptionUpdate command for a
> master-to-slave RTP stream, how long should the master wait before
> transmitting packets with the new payload type? The problem is that
> packets with the new payload type (and therefore using the new key)
> arrive before the encryptionUpdate command that tells the slave what
> payload-type/key pair to expect! There are three solutions as I see
>     A. The slave discards new packets until the encryptionUpdate
> command arrives.
>     B. The master uses prior network behavior to predict when the
> will receive the command and then waits so that packets using the new
> payload type will (hopefully) arrive sometime after that. The slave
> should still implement A because this prediction is imprecise.
>     C. We require a three-way handshake by adding an
> encryptionUpdateAck command for master-to-slave streams (would be
> redundant for slave-to-master streams). This would be backwards
> compatible because existing implementations would simply ignore this
> new command which is sent from slave to master.
> A and B are local workarounds; C is the ultimate solution. Discarding
> packets is especially problematic for video because video compression
> schemes rely on inter-packet dependencies. I believe H.233 anticipated
> this problem by providing a codepoint in H.245 to define how long the
> transmitter must wait before using the new key. H.235 also needs
> something to address this problem, preferably C.
> MEU:> In general, I agree that this might be a problem. However, in
> practice, situation should not be that worse.
> First of all, question is, if you really need encryptionUpdate. For
> I've heard so far is, that for secure IPVoiceTelephony,
encryptionUpdate can
> probably be omitted (but for video the situation may be different).

PL:> But the Voice Encryption Security Profile requires re-key:
D.7.2/H.235v2: "The key refresh rate shall be such that no more than 2
[^]32 blocks are encrypted using the same key." Besides this
requirement, I just thought that re-keying was good practice in
general, but I'm new to the field of security. What is best practice
for this and what are the considerations? Hmmm... doing some quick
calculations, it looks like it could take at least a few years to reach
2^32 blocks. Is your point that, since most calls don't last months or
years, it's probably okay not to ever re-key?

MEU:> To be precise, Annex D requires a key refresh at some point in time
(upper bound for expired key as given in your citation), but does not
actually mandate the exact method (it is a MAY) and other methods than
described (like replacementFor, close/reopen) could be applied as well.
Nevertheless, key update is a good practice in those cases, where the key
has been compromised or is believed having been compromised; this could
happen far before the key actually expires. Such situations might arise
anytime but clearly are an issue of security policy how to handle. As you
assumed, key update for voice would rarely occur under realistic situations
as far as voice telephony is concerned.
Annex E.2 conveys a tiny footnote giving an example how long a key may be
used for a particular voice codec: "key-update for secure G.711 speech
coding should occur latest after transmission of 2**30 64-bit blocks, that's
more than 12 days of ongoing conversation.". As it becomes apparent, that
turns out to be a pretty long time for ongoing secure conversation; and
thus, the key update method probably is not implemented as a high priority
feature. Let me note however, that the key refresh period depends on the
codec and the amount of transmitted traffic, thus, the situation for video
may be completely different than for G.711 voice.

[snip (A and B sound okay)]
> Your solution C with a 3-way handshake acknowledging the reception of
> new key appears as a robust solution.

PL:> So that we don't have to add another codepoint to the H.245 ASN.1
syntax tree, I suppose we could require, starting with H.235v3, that
the slave echo back the encryptionUpdate command for a master-to-slave
logical channel (the master would never otherwise receive this

MEU:> ok agreed. We need such a mechanism.

The synchFlag would act as a transaction id so that the
master would know which of its encryptionUpdate commands this was in
response to. The master would ignore the ack's h235Key field.

MEU:> I can agree to this basically. I'm not fully convinced if it is a good
idea to use the synchFlag as a "transaction id"; mainly for the reason, that
I believe that the dyn. PT is not guaranteed to be unique over a set of
logical channels (outgoing or incoming).

So you are saying that the encryptionUpdate should also be used as an ACK
from the slave to the master?

I can see another alternative assuming the each entity knows the LCNs of the
peer and is able to associate them to the channels (for the originating
channels that should be true anyway, but also for the reverse channels),

a) to use the LCN field in the MiscelleaneousCommand,
b) enhance the encryptionSync with the master/slave CHOICE structure as you
c) let the master apply his/her LCN for the logical channel in the direction
master->slave, let the master apply the slave LCN for the logical channel in
the direction slave-> master
d) let the slave acknowledge an encryptionUpdate by another encryptionUpdate
(acting as encryptionUpdateAck) or preferably use a separate
encryptionUpdateAck for that purpose,
e) the slave reflects the received LCN (indicating master or slave choice)
in the ACK.

Otherwise, we should add an encryptionUpdateAck component to the type
CHOICE of the MiscellaneousCommand type. It would look like this:
    encryptionUpdateAck SEQUENCE { synchFlag INTEGER(0..255), ... },

MEU:> Using a separate ACK command appears clean and understandable for
everyone and avoids the overloaded use of encryptionUpdate. Thus, for the
sake of clarity, if would prefer such a solution unless H.245 blow-up is a

> However, assuming that H.245 is being transported over TCP/IP, there
> be an implicit acknowledge (at the TCP layer) for issued
> Couldn't that information be helpful to the master in deciding when
to apply
> the new key?

PL:> Remember that TCP is a streaming protocol, so I doubt whether
there is any way to know whether a particular sequence of bytes, e.g.,
a TPKT, has been received at the far end. Even if there were, I doubt
whether all TCP implementations would provide this mechanism.
Therefore, we cannot rely on the transport layer to ack receipt of the
new key. Nice try, though. :-)

MEU:> ok, I see that my assumption is a bit far fetched.   ;-)

> Instead of introducing a new handshake, using replacementFor by
opening a
> new logical channel with a new key and then closing down the former
> should provide a reliable means for key update. That way, the problem
> be covered.

PL:> That would sort of work. It also has the benefit of not having to
change the RTP payload type for the new logical channel.

There are disadvantages, however:
1. H.235 requires the use of encryptionUpdate (11.1/H.235v2: "After
receiving an encryptionUpdateRequest, a master shall send out
2. replacementFor requires a LOT more signaling, i.e.,
3. Possible (effective) packet loss if the first packet of the new
channel arrives before the last packet of the old channel, thereby
possibly causing noticeable media artifact or delay.
4. Requires twice the resources temporarilly while the two logical
channels overlap, e.g., two sockets.
5. Overall increased complexity.
We would basically be trading the lack of synchronicity between the
control channel and the media logical channel for the lack of
synchronicity between two media logical channels. I vote, no.

MEU:> Ok I recognize that you don't like replacementFor procedure for
purpose of key update for understandable reasons. So I agree, a better
solution is required.

> Regarding H.233 mechanism, I wasn't able to identify such a mechanism
> claimed (I'm not even sure that H.233 features a key update method).

PL:> You are correct--H.233 does not re-key, but it does have an
analogous mechanism to update the initialization vector. H.324 added
the codepoint, h233IVResponseTime, to H.245 to express how long the
transmitter should wait between transmitting a new IV and transmitting
frames based on that IV. This is what I was referring to.

MEU: correct. That's what I found as well. Still, I believe that the time to
wait has to be guessed due to some criteria (e.g. network delay etc). So
that solution appears to have similar problems as H.235.

> 2. H.235 says that "[the slave, acting as] a receiver (or transmitter)
> may request a new key [from the master]" and "The master may also
> decide asynchronously to distribute new key(s)." However, there is no
> codepoint in either the encryptionUpdate or encryptionUpdateRequest
> command to indicate whether it refers to a slave-to-master or master-
> slave RTP stream. The MiscellaneousCommand.logicalChannelNumber field
> is no help either because its values are assigned independently by
> transmitter--both EPs may be using the same LCN.
> MEU:> It is correct that the key update works in both directions:
either the
> master distributes a new key or the slave requests a new key from the
> master.
> I fear that you discovered a valid problem here that deserves some
fix. As
> you said it is ambiguous for the slave to which LC the
> actually refers to.
> Thus, we will have to consider some solution; e.g., by adding
a "direction
> flag" in encryptionUpdateRequest.... (apart from some semantical
> that should appear in H.235v3 and IG).

PL:> Yeah, we gotta fix this. Unfortunately, encryptionUpdate does not
have a type of its own that we can extend. We would have to extend the
EncryptionSync type, but this is used in other contexts where the
extensions would have no meaning.

MEU:> correct. We could make those extensions optional and allow the use
only for the purpose for key update, but otherwise prohibit the use of the
key update extensions.

The alternative is to add a new
codepoint that obsoletes encryptionUpdate. We would define a new
direction type, e.g.,

    EncryptionUpdateDirection ::=CHOICE
            masterToSlave NULL,
            slaveToMaster NULL,

MEU:> This sounds fine!

and add this to the type CHOICE of the MiscellaneousCommand type:

        encryptionUpdateCommand SEQUENCE
            encryptionSync EncryptionSync,
            direction EncryptionUpdateDirection,

MEU:> ok (or have this CHOICE be part of encryptionSync).

The request type would be extended thusly:

    EncryptionUpdateRequest ::=SEQUENCE
        keyProtectionMethod KeyProtectionMethod OPTIONAL,
        direction EncryptionUpdateDirection OPTIONAL,

MEU:> ok; agreed.

> Nevertheless, would it help if one
> may assume that the allocated logical channel numbers at the peer
side are
> known? This information should at least be available in principle at
> endpoints from monitoring the OpenLogicalChannel and
> commends.

PL:> The problem is not that LCNs are not know--they are all indeed
know by both sides--but that they are ambiguous.

MEU: ok.

> As it is, IMO, key resynchs should not be attempted for channels that
> have the same LCN; however, that would be difficult for equipment from
> the same vendor because, depending on the LCN-assignment scheme, the
> same values may always be used.
> MEU:> I hope that the solution that we figure out would not prohibit
> case.
> Again as above, replacementFor when applied would allow key update
> the identified problem.

PL:> No, there are four re-key scenarios, and replacementFor would only
address the one where the master asynchronously updates the key for a
master-to-slave logical channel. Plus, there are the general problems
that I pointed out, above, with the replacementFor solution.

MEU:> ok let's forget about replacementFor; it was never made actually for
key update, so we cannot expect a perfect solution here.

> 3. When the master sends an encryptionUpdate command, it specifies the
> new dynamic payload type, or DPT, in the synchFlag field; however,
> presents problems for a slave-to-master stream because the transmitter
> otherwise manages its own DPTs.

> MEU:> I agree that this appears a problem that should be fixed as
well. One
> potential solution could be that the slave provides a proposed new
> PT for the LC (to be added in EncryptionUpdateRequest).

PL:> I like that a lot. So I suppose this is what we'd have:

EncryptionUpdateRequest ::=SEQUENCE
    keyProtectionMethod KeyProtectionMethod OPTIONAL,
    synchFlag INTEGER(0..255) OPTIONAL  -- New PT component

MEU:> I'm missing the master/slave direction choice here....

I would prefer that we _require_ the master to use the PT provided by
the slave and that this value therefore not be a _proposed_ PT. I
simply see no reason to allow this kind of flexibility in the master.

MEU:> I fully agree, I should have said "indicated" instead of proposed.

Then there is the issue of the master asynchronously updating the key
for a slave-to-master logical channel. To be consistent, I would prefer
that we have the master request the PT from the slave. We could hi-jack
the encryptionUpdateRequest command for this because it otherwise isn't
conveyed from master to slave. The master in effect requests that the
slave request a new key from it. We would move from the current dialog:

slave                                        master
<- encryptionUpdate(1, 97, AES(sharedSecretKey, sessionKey2))
<- - - RTP(96, AES(sessionKey1, payload)) - - -
<- - - RTP(97, AES(sessionKey2, payload)) - - -

to this one (I also included the proposed Ack, discussed above):

slave                                        master
<- encryptionUpdateRequest(1)
encryptionUpdateRequest(1, sharedSecret, 97) ->
<- encryptionUpdate(1, 97, AES(sharedSecretKey, sessionKey2))
<- - - RTP(96, AES(sessionKey1, payload)) - - -
encryptionUpdateAck(97) ->
<- - - RTP(97, AES(sessionKey2, payload)) - - -

MEU:> Paul, I'm not certain, if I fully understand what you're saying here,
or for what that is exactly good for.
Let me ask: is it to avoid that there might be some sort of race condition
such that two key update events overlap: one key update issued by the master
to the slave for a slave-to-master logical channel while at the same time
the slave requests a new key from for that particular channel from the
master? This appears as a tricky situation...

More signaling and another (inconsequential) round-trip delay, but it
would be bullet-proof. No conflicts, no synch problems. In the mean
time, we should at least identify the possibility of a conflict in the
current standard and suggest how to deal with it.

MEU:> ok we should do that. Any suggestions, proposals?

In any way: I see that we are converging in the same direction and soon
agree on a common solution :)

So this calls action for me as editor. I think that I/we should write down
all this in a contribution and fix it, making the method clear, and further
include the stuff in H.235 and highlight the H.245 changes for Mike Nilsson
(H.245 editor). If you want I would be pleased to make this a joint
contribution between IPdialoge (?) and Siemens. What do you think?


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